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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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  2. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Not pulling punches

     
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  3. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    I’m sorry, but words mean things. The truth about what Russia is doing is more than bad enough. They are trying to subjugate the Ukrainian people, and to do that they are willing to kill as many of them as necessary. But what they are not trying to do is erase the Ukrainian people from the face of the earth as Hitler tried to do to Europe’s Jewish population and the Ottomans tried to do to their Armenian population. In fact, it runs contrary to Russia’s desired end state to do that. They want the Ukrainians compliant, working the fields again, filling the armed forces of the new and improved Russian Empire, etc. But what they don’t want is all of the Ukrainians dead or gone. I think it’s very important that we don’t throw around words like genocide when what we mean is something else a bit different.
     
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  4. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Understood & not my words, but the mayor's. And I can also see how someone in the middle of seeing his fellow Ukranians being killed/forced into Russia would make him feel like that.
     
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  5. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Oh, I know they were his words. Apologies. I hope that didn’t seem like a dressing down aimed at you. And I also get that when you’re at the center of a killing field, which the mayor is, that it can certainly feel different than it does from my safe top-down view. But that isn’t the first time I’ve heard the word genocide associated with this war and with other wars when it really wasn’t accurate. So I will continue to point out that while genocide is always a mass atrocity, not every mass atrocity is genocide.
     
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  6. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    No worries. I knew where you were coming from and I didn't think it was aimed at me but rather in the general sense. We're good. :)
     
  7. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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  8. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Quote from a BBC article about the poisoning...thought it was interesting

    "And later an official in the Ukrainian president's office, Ihor Zhovkva, told the BBC that while he hadn't spoken to Mr Abramovich, members of the Ukrainian delegation were "fine" and one had said the story was "false".

    However, BBC security correspondent Frank Gardner says it would hardly be surprising that the US would want to dampen down suggestions that anyone - especially Russia - had used a chemical weapon in Ukraine, as this could push them into retaliatory action that they are extremely reluctant to take."

    Roman Abramovich suffered suspected poisoning at talks

    (Link was provided in another thread)
     
  9. RIP

    RIP I like touchdowns Premium Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  10. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I would like to see Biden commit to taking control of the skies at night and delivering food and medicine by airdrop to the cities of Ukraine, if it is practical. I don't think Putin would be able to publicly object to that, although privately, he would be mad as hell that we interrupted his starvation of the Ukrainian people. Biden could even offer to "help Russia" by including anti-Nazi literature with the shipments, which should shut Putin up completely. We have stealth aircraft, so it seems like it should be possible in some way. I realize that our airdrop aircraft are not stealthy, so they would have to be defended. It would be dangerous the first few nights, but if the stealth bombers hit most anti-aircraft sites that tried to shoot down the airdrop planes, the rest of them would get the message quickly. Maybe the airdrop planes could operate at higher altitudes than they normally would.
     
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  11. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Why is it when they deny something it makes me worry more? Cnn live

    "Kremlin spokesperson: Russia would only use nuclear weapons against a threat to "existence of the state"

    From CNN's Sophie Jeong

    Russia would only use nuclear weapons when there is a threat to the country's existence — and not as a result of the ongoing war in Ukraine, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told PBS Newshour in an interview Monday.

    “Any outcome of the operation (in Ukraine), of course, is not a reason for usage of a nuclear weapon,” Peskov said. “We have a security concept that very clearly states that only when there is a threat for existence of the state, in our country, we can use and we will actually use nuclear weapons to eliminate the threat for the existence of our country.""
     
  12. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Cnn live

    "UK Defence official: Wagner Group is expected to deploy more than 1,000 mercenaries to Ukraine

    From CNN’s Alex Marquardt and Ellie Kaufman

    The notorious Russian private military group Wagner has deployed to eastern Ukraine according to UK Defence Attaché to Washington, AVM Mick Smeath.

    According to a British embassy statement, Smeath said, “They are expected to deploy more than 1,000 mercenaries, including senior leaders of the organisation, to undertake combat operations.”

    Smeath added, “Due to heavy losses and a largely stalled invasion, Russia has highly likely been forced to reprioritise Wagner personnel for Ukraine at the expense of operations in Africa and Syria.”"

    ......

    TBH thought they were already there?
     
  13. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Russia moving more Wagner Group veteran fighters into Eastern Ukraine. Some intel on incoming flights and some properly positioned stingers to take out the troop transports would be a good thing

    Ukraine war: Russia's Wagner Group deployed in east - UK intel. (msn.com)

    British military intelligence said on Monday the Russian private military company, the Wagner Group, has been deployed to eastern Ukraine.

    “They are expected to deploy more than 1,000 mercenaries, including senior leaders of the organization, to undertake combat operations,” Britain’s Ministry of Defence said.

    The report claims that Wagner personnel have been prioritized for the conflict in Ukraine rather than in operations in Africa and Syria. This was motivated by heavy losses and an invasion that has been slowed due to fierce Ukrainian resistance and severe logistical issues.
     
  14. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Started as a joke almost but hypersonic threats & the new reality makes Space Force more important than originally thought

    Space Force Gets Roughly 40% Increase in Biden Request

    "The Space Force is requesting $24.5 billion in the 2023 budget, roughly 40 percent more than in last year’s request. Officials said the jump reflects the urgency to launch and defend satellites that can spot a hypersonic missile, track a moving truck, assure U.S. nuclear command and control, and more.

    Among areas that need improving, “There's no more important services than missile warning and the nuclear command-and-control capability we get from space,” Air Force Secretary Frank Kendall said Friday in a pre-budget briefing with reporters.

    The plus-up also reflects the new missions that Space Force will absorb from the Space Development Agency; they focus on defending satellites and creating a new layer of hundreds of lower-orbit satellites to minimize the effect of losing one."
     
  15. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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  16. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    The number of credible journalists confirming this story makes it unlikely it’s not true.
     
  17. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Either he's paranoid or he's planning something. Especially since they keep parroting the line about not using nukes unless there's an existential threat.

     
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  18. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    More likely isolating themselves from those who would try to kill or overthrow them.
     
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  19. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Cnn live

    "Russia says it will "drastically reduce" military assault on Kyiv and Chernihiv

    From Daria Markina

    Moscow says it will “drastically reduce military activity” on two fronts — Kyiv and Chernihiv — according to the Russian Ministry of Defense Telegram channel.

    Russian Deputy Defense Minister Alexander Fomin confirmed "to radically, at times, reduce military activity," according to state media RIA.

    The move follows talks between Russian and Ukrainian delegations in Istanbul on Tuesday.

    "Due to the fact that negotiations on the preparation of an agreement on the neutrality and non-nuclear status of Ukraine, as well as on the provision of security guarantees to Ukraine, are moving into practice, taking into account the principles discussed during today's meeting, by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation in order to increase mutual trust and create the necessary conditions for further negotiations and achieving the ultimate goal of agreeing on the signing of the above agreement, a decision was made to radically, at times, reduce military activity in the Kiev and Chernigov direction," Fomin told reporters"
    ........

    Ok first I'm skeptical. BUT if true, they're pointing to Ukraine's neutral status and non nuclear status. THEY WERE ALREADY NEUTRAL & NONNUCLEAR. *facepalm* trying to spin it as a win/concession.
     
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  20. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Let them stew. Make it clear no negotiations with Putin because he can't be trusted nor be reasonable. Use an intermediary if needed but they won't even answer the emergency lines between the Defense ministers.

    Cnn live

    "Kremlin says dialogue between Russia and US still necessary

    From CNN's Lindsay Isaac

    Dialogue between Russia and the US is still needed, despite recent statements from US President Joe Biden that “damage the relations,” said Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov on Tuesday.

    “Personal insults cannot but leave their negative mark on relations between heads of state,” Peskov said.
    “Nevertheless, dialogue between Russia and the United States is necessary in any case, not only in the interests of our the two countries but also in the interests of the whole world,” he added.

    “One way or another, sooner or later, [Russia and the US] will have to talk about issues of strategic stability, security, and other issues that only we can discuss," he said."