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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    He believes it is right because he believes Ukraine is ultimately part of Russia. Whether he believes they are Nazis, I doubt it, he rationalizes lies and propoganda as a means to a “just” end.
     
  2. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Exactly. At this point in his mind it's already war, so might as well. He knows he'd only win with nukes, though, against the US, & only because the world ends.
     
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  3. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    Depends on how you define “worked”. Rarely do they cause regime change. But if they are severe enough they cause the economy to crater such that they are powerless to do much else, and it serves as an example to other authoritarians that if you try to expand your territory it isn’t going to end well for you.

    These sanctions are pretty unique in their severity, so if there was a chance at regime change perhaps this is it.
     
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  4. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

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    I think he cares about staying in power. For years, he has done this by protecting the interests of certain oligarchs that straddle the line between the legal and illegal economies (utilizing government resources either directly or indirectly to their benefit). These folks are the real power brokers in Russia, not Putin himself. A lot of them are not thrilled about losing their businesses, access to the places that they spend time outside of Russia, Yachts, etc.
     
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  5. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

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    Seems so. No international transactions either way.
     
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  6. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    That's why going after the oligarchs is so vital & unique here.
     
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  7. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

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    The end justifies the means, that also sounds familiar.
     
  8. danmann65

    danmann65 All American

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    I want to donate to help somehow. Anyone know of a good charity that will actually help the people?
     
  9. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    US agreeing to backfill Poland air force responsibilities to allow Poland to seng MiGs to Ukraine

    Subscribe to read | Financial Times

    President Volodymyr Zelensky has urged Washington to provide Poland and other eastern European allies with American aircraft that would then enable those countries to send Russian-made military planes to Ukraine.
    In a call with almost 300 US lawmakers, Zelensky made an emotional plea for help and said Ukraine badly needed more aircraft, particularly after Nato decided against creating a no-fly zone because it would risk a broader conflict with Russia, according to people familiar with the call.
    Zelensky asked the US to provide Poland and three other Nato countries with US aircraft that would allow them up to then send Russian-made aircraft to Ukraine, the people said. Ukrainian pilots need Russian-made aircraft since those are the systems they have been trained to fly.
     
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  10. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    Putin made the Oligarchs. They owe him. Not the other way around
     
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  11. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

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    I would also hope that training is underway for Ukrainian pilots to learn how to fly American, French, and British jets.
     
  12. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    I believe they are all Migs being loaned. Training pilots to combat level would seem to be a lengthy undertaking
     
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  13. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    While I agree with this, he has been, and continues to be, paid very well. It may be that the current ask will prove to be too high
     
  14. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    Many of the oligarchs made their money starting in the 90s.
     
  15. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    Zelensky is fabulous. Never would have thought he’d much more than a passing consideration when news came out of him standing up to Trump.

     
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  16. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

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    I'd disagree somewhat on that. They made themselves in the aftermath of the Soviet breakup. A lot of them were either upper middle management in the Soviet state-owned industries or ran some semi-legal business in their industries and used their position to purchase their assets for pennies on the dollar from the state prior to Putin. Look at somebody like Roman Abramovich as a good representative example. He was involved in the semi-legal trading of energy under the Soviets. He and a partner (who ran the Pro-Yeltsin TV station at the time) put together $150 million to purchase assets that almost instantly "became" worth $2.7 billion. He did so through a bribery scheme. A year later, he is suddenly living in the Kremlin, as he had become "close" to Yeltsin and then he recommended to him that Putin be his replacement 3 years later.
     
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  17. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

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    Pretty savage troll move by Z.
     
  18. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    About time!!
     
  19. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    Putin is his own business person. The Oligarchs are his junior partners. He doesn’t work for them.
     
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  20. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    They stole the resources of the country. Putin was responsible when he was Yeltsins number 2 and after he replaced Yeltsin. Read Red Notice.
     
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