Welcome home, fellow Gator.

The Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. gatorzilla91

    gatorzilla91 All American

    335
    111
    1,873
    Nov 21, 2014
    Marco Rubio’s latest tweet is very interesting…basically sounds like Putin has become completely unhinged.

    MSNBC also reporting that a lot of top Russian people are against this war now
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Informative Informative x 2
  2. Emmitto

    Emmitto VIP Member

    8,723
    1,607
    933
    Apr 3, 2007
    It was not a given. Just yesterday they very prominently blamed the US for Russia attacking Ukraine.

    It is true that there was no need, since one veto is all that is needed.

    Still, not the solidarity that is in display otherwise.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  3. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

    8,528
    1,973
    1,483
    May 31, 2007
    Fresno, CA
    Oh, to your point, I think China will remember how to use its veto power in the unlikely event this move to strip Russia of its veto power somehow works out.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  4. thomadm

    thomadm VIP Member

    2,574
    641
    2,088
    Apr 9, 2007
    Lets hope his own people topple him and we avoid anymore bloodshed.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  5. reboundgtr

    reboundgtr VIP Member

    1,456
    363
    1,808
    Oct 14, 2017
    Jawja
    The age of tank warfare is rapidly coming to a close with modern tandem anti tank war head missiles. Low viz launches and fire and forget technology from ground and drones. Let alone A-10s and Apache capability.

    Best of all I hope it ushers in the demise of Putin with his ill advised offensive and dreams of former Soviet style communism.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2022
  6. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

    8,465
    792
    2,843
    Apr 16, 2007
    It seemed like a lot of the people interpreting his declaration of war speech thought it was unhinged

    In addition to the crazed “denazification” references, apparantly he has given another one overnight where he called the Ukrainian leadership drug addicts hiding in a basement. Also threatened to drop the international space station on China or India.

    So yeah…it sounds plausible. Rubio is far from the first to think this. Might not even be an intelligence assessment, seems to be almost popular opinion.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2022
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  7. reboundgtr

    reboundgtr VIP Member

    1,456
    363
    1,808
    Oct 14, 2017
    Jawja
    If they attacked across the Perekop (sp) Isthmus it is a swampy venture that gave the Germans fits in WW2. The layout favors the defenders. Javelins are no joke at long distance.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  8. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

    7,743
    648
    1,193
    Jan 20, 2008
    Tallahassee, FL
    Tweet here:



    I have my issues with Rubio, but when you’re the Vice Chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee and you tweet this…
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Bazza

    Bazza Moderator

    37,057
    14,275
    3,803
    Jan 2, 2009
    New Smyrna Beach
    Like I said - not going to debate here. Should be self-explanatory though. No offense....
     
  10. Emmitto

    Emmitto VIP Member

    8,723
    1,607
    933
    Apr 3, 2007
    Agreed.

    But it also leaves Russia dangling, already in danger of otherwise arcane “abuse of power” UN mechanicians.

    The sooner Russia is gone from the UN the better, IMO. They have long given up on the spirit of the idea, for whatever that whole idea is worth now.

    China doesn’t have the same Burn It All motivations.

    I do indeed worry that we’ve finally found the deranged maniac with nothing to lose but everything needed to flush the whole toilet. Sadly China could be the savior here.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

    15,472
    1,970
    1,718
    Dec 9, 2010
    Yeah, that would make sense. This was not a smart strategic move, even if they "take" Ukraine. What will they gain? A massive internal insurrection. The top Russian folks are strategic and can recognize this.
     
  12. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

    3,051
    939
    1,858
    Nov 24, 2021
    Buffalo NY
    Hopefully someone in the military or the public removes him. At the very least, let's hope enough Russian military members refuse to fire nukes. Because Putin seems unhinged enough to unload & send us back to the Middle Ages.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  13. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

    8,465
    792
    2,843
    Apr 16, 2007
    It would be nice to think someone inside Russia would say “enough” and just take him out. Save the people of Ukraine, save Russian lives too.

    Maybe we should ask little Marco and all the last admin sycophants the mentality of going along to get along with a sociopath as your leader.
     
  14. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

    8,528
    1,973
    1,483
    May 31, 2007
    Fresno, CA
    Personally, I don’t believe that. I think man-portable anti-tank missiles certainly help level the field with infantry. The Yom Kippur War demonstrated that. But now, as then, it was massed armored spearheads that were decisive in the end. I think what we are likely to see next is more and more effective countermeasures mounted either on the tanks themselves or on support vehicles that follow close behind.

    You’ll notice that the ATGMs we’ve provided Ukraine have (reportedly) slowed up Russia’s advance (good) and increased Russian casualties (good), but the juggernaut has kept moving and should slam shut around Kyiv within the next 24 hours. Once that happens, I think Russia will be able to take its time, and that will reduce the effect of those missiles. A methodical advance along wider fronts will be slower, but Russia can make better use of its artillery to roll barrages in front of the lead elements. That will keep their casualties from ATGMs way down.

    I’m a lot more interested in data (not just anecdotal stuff) about how effective our Stingers have been against their aircraft. We’re going to need to know as much as possible for Russia’s next move, unfortunately.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

    3,051
    939
    1,858
    Nov 24, 2021
    Buffalo NY
    I know there's a resolution about getting them off the council but didn't know about the whole UN part.

    How does that even take place? Is there a mechanism for any of this? Honestly I'd think taking a "legal" stance that they don't actually have a seat since they're not the USSR might have a shot since charters and bylaws are so specific.

    But CAN they get voted out? March is next week so Russia won't be heading the council to block stuff from coming up.
     
  16. reboundgtr

    reboundgtr VIP Member

    1,456
    363
    1,808
    Oct 14, 2017
    Jawja
    Because combat is as clear as mud. Yeah nothing like mission creep to escalate something we don't need to be involved in. Nothing like a SAR mission for a US/NATO downed aircrew end up being a nice little fracas. I would like all the war mongers to put a family member in the line of fire. What nonsense
     
    • Disagree Bacon! Disagree Bacon! x 1
  17. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

    3,051
    939
    1,858
    Nov 24, 2021
    Buffalo NY
    He's already said he's willing to negotiate so not sure what this guy wants him to do....run & find some Russians to surrender to so they can use that as more propaganda, & likely execute the guy? *facepalm*

    He should send his family away like others have, though. If he hasn't already.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  18. reboundgtr

    reboundgtr VIP Member

    1,456
    363
    1,808
    Oct 14, 2017
    Jawja
    I would definitely like to see some data after this is through. I still say tank warfare will change. Massed formations aren't it imo. In the urban areas they are toast without adequate infantry support. Im looking for the video where the Turks had 14 Leopard A4s taken out by Russian made Syrian ATGMs and US ITOWs.
     
  19. murphree_hall

    murphree_hall VIP Member

    8,505
    4,279
    2,898
    Jul 11, 2019
    He can't really do that because he's the President and he will be seen as saving his family members using his privilege while the average Ukrainian can't leave. If he does that, he will lose all support and Russian propaganda machines will be all over it.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Disagree Bacon! Disagree Bacon! x 1
  20. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

    3,051
    939
    1,858
    Nov 24, 2021
    Buffalo NY
    So your solution & the solution of some others is to withdraw from NATO and go back to isolationism. Which is a valid viewpoint to an extent. The problem is that isn't feasible. No one is saying boots on ground. Reinforcing and bolstering the defenses of NATO countries ABSOLUTELY is a must and a duty because that's part of the agreement. Because Putin absolutely will set his eye on other former USSR territories.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1