Covid-19: Treatments, Cures, and Vaccines

Odd take to be dismissive of a pharmacist on drug information. Do you not think pharmacists know anything about drugs? What do you think they do? This is their wheelhouse.

Some (not all) pharmacists actually know a helluva lot more about drug intervention than your average family physician. Especially clinical pharmacy (in hospital or research) with 1 or 2 years of specialist residency. That’s 6 years of pharmacy school education. People that went to the top schools and work at the larger hospitals in clinical settings. At that level they would actually have far more specific base of knowledge vs. an M.D. who might have only taken some basic pharmacology in med school, clinical people would be expected to be on top of emerging research. This is literally what they went to school for.

Basically. You can’t assume anything. Some pharmacists know more than the average doctor. Some are idiots. You’d think all doctors are reliable, but some doctors are like demon sperm doc or went to questionable D.O. programs. This is why the idea of “doing your own research” online for medicine is idiotic, because you can *always* find a quack that tells you whatever you want to hear. But in either case, at worst your “average” pharmacist is probably the 2nd best direct source of drug information behind a medical doctor, but a good pharmacist might actually be a better source.

 

None had to be hospitalized, one did end up getting the anti body infusion today, her symptoms had worsened.

I only brought it up because some people make it seem like unvsccianted people are the only ones taking Ivermectin. Even worse they are getting it from Tractor Supply blah blah. Was it msnbc that reported a hospital had gun shot victims without beds because of all the people overdosing on horse dewormer? Story was false, if you're the type to take horse dewormer, then you're right the vaccine really shouldn't scare you.

However, to act like people taking Ivermectin is a risk is just false. For some reason, and I can't figure it out for the life of me, why people are so offended by the unvaccinated. It's a strange mindset to say the least.

 

Probably because they choose to put everyone at risk. Also, they continue to get sick and suck up resources at an alarming rate. Finally, they are willfully prolonging this pandemic.

Other than those painfully obvious reasons you mean?

 

It’s not just about the idiots taking horse paste, which is actually dangerous. A prescribed dose of the human drug wouldn’t likely be “dangerous”.

However to say it has NO risk is false. All drugs have some risk of side effects, including rare serious ones. Do you think the side effect risk of ivermectin is greater or lesser than a particular vaccine? Most people pimping Ivermectin probably can’t even answer that (I have no idea either).

The thing is, whatever the small risk level is of consuming the prescribed drug, there is no evidence Ivermectin does anything at all to treat COVID. The manufacturer, Merck (big pharma) even says as much. So what if it has roughly similar risks to the vaccine... and does absolutely nothing. Still makes sense to you? It barely makes sense in any context with the currently available evidence, but if suggested in lieu of an effective vaccine, it’s ludicrous - pretty much malpractice if a doctor takes that position.

 

I have a neibour who graduated from UF with a degree in Agriculture and is a successful farmer. A few weeks ago after my anti vaccer brother died from covid, he dropped in and told me that his older brother who lives in south fla, tested positive for covid, so he "found" some ivermection near gainesville and had it overnighted to his brother.
He assured me it was safe to take as long as you take 1oz per so many lbs.
Horse paste--------no local feed store had any left in stock

 

Exactly my stance on the subject. The vaccine has proven to be enormously safe, just like every other vaccine before it. Nothing is 100% without risk, but it makes no logical sense for these people to talk about how they don’t know what’s in the shot and they don’t trust it, even though those of us who have gotten it and the booster are totally fine months later and it’s now been FDA approved, but then pump up Ivermectin like they actually know what the active and inactivate ingredients in it are.

 

Odd take to discuss how doctors may not be that good at what they do but then close with the reality a doctor is who you should seek advice from when it comes to your health and Covid for that matter.

 

Every anti-vaxxer’s (or do they want to be called pureblood’s now, lol) stance on the matter basically. I don’t and won’t get the shot to protect myself and others around me, and won’t take doctors or scientists words about how safe and effective the vaccine is, but damn it, if I end up in the ICU on my death bed, you better be there to take care of me. It’s a shame that so many people who actually need to be seen for non Covid related issues can’t because of this insanity. Covid isn’t just killing the people who catch it, but gunshot and car crash victims, etc. because they can’t get seen by a doctor due to all these loons taking up beds.

 

Straying bzack into discussions and opinions better suited for the main thread. Can we please keep this one thread clean for information and free of opinions and debate?

 

Eli Lilly joins Regeneron in gaining approval for under expanding EUA to use their antibody cocktail as a prophylaxis. Now, if someone has been exposed to COVID, they can be treated with the Lilly cocktail in an effort to prevent developing Covid.

There was also a discussion about this on the Dr. Radio last night on Sirius XM. Guests were lementing how so many GP's around the country are completely ignorant of the proper standards of care for COVID patients and how many around the country are suffering needlessly because their doctors still do not even know about these treatments, let alone know when to send patients or even how. Some have criticized governors like DeSantis for pushing these treatments (sometimes in lieu of vaccination) but at least he is trying to raise awareness of this highly successful (when given at the proper phase of infection) treatment and more awareness needs to be raised.

COVID-19 tracker: Moderna scores first full approval in Canada; Lilly nabs expanded FDA nod as post-exposure med

 

First peer reviewed publication looking at/ confirming Delta variant efficacy at evading neutralizing antibodies that I have seen.

Anyone who likes to "geek out" over data and likes a lot of cool images of the experiments, what the spike protein looks like, as well as a cartoon of how the infection process works, this is your paper.

If that is not your cup of tea, the short version is that the researchers confirmed that in-vitro (petri dishes, not live subjects) delta variant effectively evaded neutralizing antibodies produced by vaccines, as well as in some mAb treatments and therefore the bodies own immune system that mAbs were copied from as well. They confirmed that the Delta variant successfully spread in the upper airway and the epithelial cells of the upper airway in particular. NOTE: They did not study how T-cells interacted with the variant, so the majority of the work discusses liklihood of infection, not development of disease or severe disease.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03944-y_reference.pdf

 

That’s not even what I said. My point was I wouldn’t be quick to dismiss a pharmacist p.o.v... when it comes to drugs of all things. Drugs are the pharmacists wheelhouse.

Both should be going off the data for determining the appropriate treatment.

 

FWIW...Ivermectin for COVID-19: real-time meta analysis of 63 studies

 

I don’t disagree. But listening to a pharmacist rant about filling ivermectin prescribed by doctors who are trained to treat their patients and using the data they do (people can agree or disagree/seek second opinions)…is a bit rich. But hey…if the pharmacist talks one out of what their doctor suggests…I don’t have an issue with it.

 

No idea what to make of this.

 

Talking to someone in the know here locally, our hospital was full, but apparently our hospital runs pretty high capacity on ICU beds anyway. Covid or not.
Perhaps we are seeing the need for hospitals to up their capacity in the general sense.

In other words, in some places it doesn't take many Covid cases to fill the ICU.

 

US panel backs COVID-19 boosters only for seniors, high-risk (apnews.com)
WASHINGTON (AP) — Dealing the White House a stinging setback, a government advisory panel overwhelmingly rejected a plan Friday to give Pfizer COVID-19 booster shots across the board, and instead endorsed the extra vaccine dose only for those who are 65 or older or run a high risk of severe disease.

The twin votes represented a heavy blow to the Biden administration’s sweeping effort, announced a month ago, to shore up nearly all Americans’ protection amid the spread of the highly contagious delta variant.

In a surprising turn, the advisory panel rejected, 16-2, boosters for almost everyone. Members cited a lack of safety data on extra doses and also raised doubts about the value of mass boosters, rather than ones targeted to specific groups.

Then, in an 18-0 vote, it endorsed extra shots for people 65 and older and those at risk of serious disease. Panel members also agreed that health workers and others who run a high risk of being exposed to the virus on the job should get boosters, too.

“I don’t think a booster dose is going to significantly contribute to controlling the pandemic,” said Dr. Cody Meissner of Tufts University. “And I think it’s important that the main message we transmit is that we’ve got to get everyone two doses.”

 

It pretty much highlights the fact that in 3rd world countries parasites are running rampant in humans due to the inability to obtain clean, freshwater.

 

“Pureblood” except for all those other vaccines in them lol