Covid-19: Treatments, Cures, and Vaccines

Watch: NCAA Athlete Hit with Severe Heart Complication After COVID Vaccine, Warns Against Vax Mandates (westernjournal.com)
On Aug. 31, 2021, John Stokes was preparing for his senior season playing Division 1 NCAA golf at Tennessee State University. By Sept. 6, the 21-year-old was hospitalized with heart complications.

What changed during the span of those four days? According to Stokes, he received the second dose of the COVID-19 vaccine.

“I am a Division 1 student-athlete with no prior health issues, and I got the second COVID shot Tuesday [on Aug. 31],” he said in a now-viral TikTok video. “And within four days, I have been diagnosed with myocarditis and was told that I probably won’t be able to play my senior season now.”

“The known risks of COVID-19 illness and its related, possibly severe complications, such as long-term health problems, hospitalization, and even death, far outweigh the potential risks of having a rare adverse reaction to vaccination, including the possible risk of myocarditis or pericarditis.”

 

No doubt any medicine can have side effects, but the chances of adverse reactions from the vaccine are so minuscule the odds are so much in your favor of not experiencing one that it’s the easy choice to get it. Besides, Covid is having wicked long term side effects in far more people than the vaccine. Risk versus reward scenario.

 

Some excerpts from the Lancet publication, co-authored by several people including the two people who are resigning from the FDA, and universities including Oxford, Univeristy of Florida and University of Bristol and the World Health Organization. They present some very compelling data showing that the push for US nation wide boosters is not necessary at this time. Very good opinion piece and worth reading if you have the time.

DEFINE_ME

 

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So long as the hospitals keep saying their patients are overwhelmingly unvaccinated, this would line up with what is anecdotally being reported (pretty much everywhere). The vaccines work phenomenally against severe disease. No evidence for a young person to even think about a booster at the 8 month mark.

That being said, for those 70+ I’d probably be inclined to jump the gun even if the data is still murky. It also very much depends on which vaccine, I feel a bit more confident with the Moderna shot than I would with Pfizer. There’s enough to suggest it’s still a positive payoff (10 or 20% hospitalized cases being vaccinated leaves room for concern, the question is if the 3rd dose can knock it back down to 0%, or if these are just vulnerable people that even a 3rd dose isn’t going to change).

Perhaps i wouldn’t rush right at 8 months for those coming up on it, but something to consider once you start coming around on 1 year and heading back into flu and cold season. Technically nobody in the public should even be quite at 8 months from full vaccination right now (unless participating in an early trial), so those millions that have already gone rogue to get the 3rd dose are a bit crazy in my view. But I guess we can thank them for demonstrating the safety profile and experimenting even with taking a different shot, which is something I would have wondered about.

 

Crickets? A simple clarification please.

 

I never said it was better than natural immunity. I said that the path to natural immunity is infection which for many people is not a safe one.
I anecdotally have someone in my extended circle that recently died from Covid that had no know preexisting issues. Mid 40's, left wife and 3 kids.
A friend of a friend type of thing. I know it's very rare, but it does happen.

Remember FL. I am someone who supports your right top refuse the vax. I was with you up until last month myself.
I just don't want people doing it while trying to convince others that the vax is a failure when it clearly is not.

Trust your body. Take precautions to protect others in public and I am am fully OK with your decision.
But don't try to convince people on the fence that this vax is useless. That is all I ask.

 

Which is why I wish I waited another month or so. There is still info to be gained by waiting (if your reason is a sincere effort to make the best decision).

 

I completely disagree with the comment about the Moderna shot. Whether or not neutralizing antibodies last longer by a month or two from one vaccine vs the other is irrelevant in the long term. Frankly, being protected sooner, rather than later was more important. Further, the length of time that the memory-B cells and the memory T-cells is far more important than short lived antibodies. All 3 vaccines approved in the US appear to be generating the same long duration memory B/T cells at this point. Finally, the reactogenicity of the Moderna shot appears to be greater, with greater numbers of adverse events relative to the population immunized with that vaccine, so there are also minuses as well.

Meanwhile, the UK is about embark upon boosters for everyone 55 and up and they are crossing vaccines since most of the country has the AZ vaccine, they are only using the Pfizer or Moderna (not previously used in the UK) at half dose (50 ugram vs 100 ugram) for the boosters. I think waiting on a booster as long as possible (or maybe never needing one) is smart, however, since many studies are in process looking at greater benefits derived by boosting with a different vaccine than the original prime/boost shot pair.

 

I guess my point is, We need to offer some grace to those who are seeking the best fit for them and stop assuming everyone arrives at the same conclusion at the same time. That is not a reality for the human species. It never has been and it never will.

FWIW, I really appreciate all that you have brought to the discussions. I find your data objective and very helpful.

 

I hear but just don't totally agree with you about the Vax. I'm sorry for your loss

 

It is very obvious that getting whatever vaccine is available is vastly superior than waiting months to try to find something that is incrementally better. While I'm glad you made the right decision, this attempt to delay optimize really becomes a rationalization excuse for anti vaxxers who are resisting for reasons that go beyond science.

 

I suggest the pharmacist let the doctor do their job.

 

Like giving antibiotics for viral infections? Docs do that, too.

 

This is true.

 

I’m trying to make sense of this post.

Was his take a shot at pharmacists or something? It doesn’t even make sense, it’s not like pharmacists are the only ones giving vaccines, or that doctors don’t play a role in vaccine development just as they do with drug development/testing. Hell that is a somewhat recent development in the practice pharmacy, the idea you walk into a retail pharmacy for a vaccine. I’ve actually never done that myself. All mine growing up were given at a doctors office. For the COVID vaccine I went to the dept of health. One shot actually was given by a pharmacist, the other was a nurse. With the “special handling” required for these vaccines, I actually trusted the dept of health far more than a CVS store. Comfort in bigger numbers I guess...

 

It was definitely a shot at the poster that is a pharmacist. Insinuated that he was not as knowledgeable as a doctor. My post was to remind folks that sometimes doctors prescribe things simply because the patient asks for them thinking "what's the harm?"

 

I was responding to someone who chimed in about their personal experience where ivermectin worked...who was responding to a rant from a poster who is a pharmacist complaining about filling ivermectin. On the following post I responded by liking the post where they had a positive personal experience where ivermectin was not used.

My point was that ivermectin should not be called a miracle drug and at the same time it should not be demonized. I did not want to get into a back and forth with a ranting pharmacist so I commented vaguely to someone who had responded to them. I think it is better for the doctor to make the decision on whether to use ivermectin and avoid the advice of a ranting pharmacist on too hot.

 

Except you don't really know if the ivermectin worked, do you? Maybe it was strictly coincidence. We also don't know whose idea the ivermectin was, do we? Did the doc offer it or did the patients ask for it?

FYI, not really sure I would call it a rant but you do you.

 

antibiotics being overprescribed is certainly an issue. It has nothing to do with ivermectin in this case. Ivermectin has been demonized and lauded that it is sadly a political football now.

I will just say that ivermectin is something one should discuss with their doctor if they get Covid. They may or may not suggest taking it. But there are some positive results. Some doctors will say take the shot with it. Others may not.