Feds thwart plot to kidnap Whitmer

I am not spinning the numbers: I am reporting them. Their cases/population are currently lower, their deaths/population are currently lower, their tests/population are higher, their test positivity rate is lower. You are trying to spin by counting deaths that were sparked by cases contracted pre-shutdown as an indictment against her current shutdown policy. And then talking about it like it is a current issue, not a past issue. That isn't an honest look at the situation.

 

Agree Davis, but Florida has an arguably harder population to protect. That is a huge part of what a state like Florida deals with.

 

91% was at a time when it was impossible to be tested even when someone was sick.

 

At first I thought this was a J. Crew ad.

 

I am being 100% honest. I am just reporting numbers too. This is a pandemic. Not a one week event. No one has handled it perfectly, but over the entire run of this virus, with a much older population and a state twice as big, and New Yorkers flocking to it early on, Desantes sits here in October with basically the same percentage numbers and half the unemployment problem.

None of that condones Ms. Whitmer's mistreatment, but it does leave her open to heavy criticism.

 

The initial surge in Michigan was at an earlier stage of the disease when less was known about spread, risk factors, mitigation (such as mask wearing), disease courses, and treatment. And when there was less testing. So there are too many confounding factors to rely on to blame governors for deaths on the early days. Today, people wear masks which reduces viral load for those who are exposed and may get sick, but not as sick. Positional treatments as apposed to Ventilators, which are now a last resort. Various anti vitals and anti clotting agents now used. And governors don’t treat patients medically. The “number of deaths” comparison over time is misleading.

 

You are absolutely not being 100% honest. It isn't a 1 week event, but you are trying to talk about the effects of a policy with numbers that happened before the policy was fully implemented and treating them like they are current and an indication of the efficacy of the policy. That is not proper or honest.

Florida doesn't have "basically the same percentage numbers." The current test positivity rate is 3x. The current death rate is more than 3x, when controlling for population differences.

And Florida's unemployment rate is not "half the problem," whatever that even means. Michigan has 1.3% higher unemployment than Florida.

Everybody should be open to criticism, but it should be well-founded criticism. This isn't even close to that.

 

what?!? They were planning to kidnap and kill her and your response is well look at the bad job she’s doing??

 

14 day changes Michigan:
Deaths Up 7%
Cases Up 28%

14 day changes Florida:
Death Down 14%
Cases Down 16%

 

I linked the unemployment data. And at no point am I being dishonest. I clearly said "As a whole". And your 7 day numbers only tell part of the story. The 14 day totals tell a different one.

 

Um...no. I have (I believe four times now) condemned their actions.

 

Florida has 6.4% more folks in higher risk age-groups than Michigan. Mitigation measures can only go so far and cannot necessarily be judged based only on the end numbers since it's not an absolute correlation and cannot account for the behaviors of people despite measures. Deaths in Michigan occurred earlier when the medical community didn't know as much about treatment protocols but have come down dramatically, at a quicker rate. Deaths in Florida on the other hand surged over the summer and have stayed at considerably higher numbers since then.

 

And no clue how you get to "twice the problem with unemployment." Florida lost more jobs, although a lower percentage due to higher population. But not half the percentage.

You are evaluating a policy utilizing data from prior to the implementation of that policy as if it was a result of that policy. That is not proper and shows an inaccurate picture.

14 day moving averages of cases:

Michigan: 988
Florida: 2301

14 day moving averages of deaths:

Michigan: 12
Florida: 92

 

How did this become a Florida vs Michigan COVID debate?

 

No, you're spinning numbers. Any objective look at Florida and Michigan shows that Michigan has done much better than Florida over the last 5 months or so. Michigan had a high death count early on, before any shut down could have had an impact. Since then, there is no comparison between MI and FL.

 

I know we see this differently, but thanks for making your point without personal shots or accusations of "dishonesty". I always appreciate that about you two.

 

This is what happens when a poster hijacks a thread with dubious facts and numbers.

 

Classic!! Bravo.

 

Sounds like you’re offering justification based on your politics.